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Absolute Naturists Nudism and Obesity
| I am interested to hear what others have to say on this topic. I know I will take some flack for my views...thats ok they are just my views but Id like to hear how others feel. maybe I can learn something. As we all are aware we are becoming a very fat nation. Used to be you would see an obese person once in a while. Now it seems as though you see several everyday. What is the cause? There is lots of discussion but no real answers. I know its not good though and when I see an obese person I naturally think that they have no regard for their personal well being. So where does it fit into the world of Naturism. Just take a look at the latest issue of the Bulletin from AANR. Almost everyone pictured in that are overwieght and some are obese. I myself could stand to loose a few pounds. But I do not like seeing or even being around someone who is obese and nude. I know..I know. Naturism is not about body beautiful. I get that. But it is about a healty lifestyle and to see someone who has neglected themselves like that does not fit into what I believe is a healthy life style. Ive tried to introduce others to the world of social nudism and the one big turnoff for them is being around folks who are 100 pounds overweight. They just dont like seeing it or being around it. So...what say you | |
| Overweight and obese people are a fact of life. I'd rather see them in nothing, than in an ill-fitting swimsuit at the beach. We can't all be fit, hard bodies. *shrug* I'm not in perfect shape, but it's because I have a neurological condition that prevents me for working out and exercising. I'm not obese, though. | |
| Sunofabeach that's a tough one. I praise you for talking about it because people who are not nudist don't even like talking about this. I've been a personal trainer for 30 years. This is the hardest part of the job because it has to do with someone's WHOLE lifestyle, eating, sleeping and exercise. 90% or more obese people eat too much and move too little. A no brainer right? But those same 90% plus, also have emotionial issues and people WILL jump on your back if you try to bring those up. The nudist community wonders why they can't get young people interested. Really? No wonder! Harsh talk I know but we are talking about your HEALTH! And if you're more then 10% or 15% above your ideal bodyweight then you need to address this. | |
| I think it's the poor quality of food that is today's reality. When I grew up, processed, pre-packaged food was the exception, rather then the rule. I was lucky, the economy back then didn't require two incomes to make things work. So mom was home, made excellent meals with healthier ingredients. Our food industry is incapable of this today. There's no profit in food that can't sit on a shelf for a long time. I went to our local grocery stores looking to eat healthier, and was pretty much stymied. People only want to buy what's fast and easy to make (lack of time), so that's what stores carry. It's money. When I've mentioned (complained) about this in other forums, I'm told to go to farmer's markets. They stopped having those around here. They would only allow them on Friday's. Most people work on Friday. Ensured failure. | |
| We do have farmer’s markets here and that is fine when produce is in season. The farmer’s market facilities are privately owned and they rent stands to farmers. Some of the so called experts are suggesting food items that are not available in grocery stores and probably available at specialty shops in larger cities. I believe the reason it takes two incomes now a day is business realizes there is two incomes so they raised the prices. No way is anyone going to get ahead and this has been going on all my working years. | |
| The answer is more simple than folks often want to make it out to be. In short, it's calories in vs calories out. People these days largely take in way more than they need (calories), while consuming far fewer than they need. The result is increased body fat. It's simply a mathematical equation based in our biology. Overly simplified, what you take in that your body doesn't need, gets converted to and stored as fat, and in case of leaner times when it's needed again. We can thank millions of years of evolution for this, since in the past, feast or famine was literally often the rule of the day. The lack of regular exercise among all ages groups is definitely a major factor in this equation, and that's compounded by taking in way too many calories at the same time. Obviously, the nature of our food has changed, as a previous poster points out. The introduction of highly processed (high in sugar and other simple carbohydrates) food has increased the mean calorie intake of our society (in general), and while at the same time, modern technology and culture has resulted in people burning far fewer calories than we used to as a part of daily activity. It is no magic that people who watch what they eat, in conjunction with getting plenty of exercise, are lean, slim and trim. The rest of us, not so much. And I speak from experience, having allowed myself to go from being height weight proportional, to morbidly obese over the course of half a decade, due to high calorie intake with no exercise. Once I woke up and decided that I no longer wanted to be this way, I reversed the entire process, returning to not just my previous proportions, but feeling 10 years younger again. All in about two years time. Of course, gaining a ton of weight and then losing it doesn't leave your body looking quite as healthy as it once did, but it's still a vast improvement. Another problem with Americans (I am one) is this idea of focusing on "weight" rather than over all health and well-being. Chasing the needle on a scale from day to day is the worst thing we can do, and it leads to and is an integral part of our craze with "diets" these days. The desire to quickly loose weight, and by starving ourselves for weeks or months to make that happen. In almost all cases, this is a "temporary" thing which is about as unhealthy as you can be to your body. Been there, done that. When I decided to change things for me, the first thing I did was get rid of the bathroom scale. It truly is irrelevant and the wrong metric to be focusing on. As the cliche goes, it's inches not pounds that matter, and as you gain muscle mass, you gain weight, even while losing body fat. I haven't weighed myself in over 2.5 years, the last time being the day I decided to change my ways. I don't know how many pounds I've lost, and I couldn't care less. All that I know is that I went from a size 40 waist to a size 32 in less than two years. It's how I felt, and how I looked to myself in the mirror that mattered, not what that needle on a scale was reading. I also found that the daily anticipation and disappointments of what that needle would say completely screwed up my way of thinking. It was focusing on the wrong thing; that being short term changes rather than long term ones. Instead, I just implemented small but consistent changes in my daily life, namely a small but consistent reduction in calorie intake, while also beginning a habit of walking for an hour or two every day; i.e., burning calories that I hadn't been burning previously. The results were stunning, to me, and rather than focusing on daily ups and downs, over the months I was simply fitting into my old clothes again, increasing my endurance in exercise, and just feeling better all the time. And I didn't go on any "diet", didn't deprive myself of the foods I like, just stopped binging on them, and while, most importantly, burning a good deal of calories each day that I hadn't been burning. I reversed the calories in vs calories out equation in my life, and the changes came easy and painless, and I feel great. At first, I could barely walk 2 miles without being out of breath and having to get off my feet. That slowly increased to 4 and 8 and 10 miles, to the point where I have now sometimes done 20 miles in a day, at an average of 4 miles per hour (5 hours). The best way I have ever spent my time in a day. In our modern day society, filled with the temptations of high calorie foods and drinks (fast food is the worst!), exercise is essential to maintain the balance in calories in vs out. Our society has become increasingly obese because most people are not maintaining that equation. To the contrary, calorie intake has gone through the roof, while calorie consumption has steadily decreased. It's simple math, and that is the reason. Americans consume increasing amounts of calories, while burning fewer and fewer of them. That's why we're getting fatter by the year. If you eat smart (avoid too many the high carbohydrate foods) and get reasonable daily exercise, you can find and maintain a healthy balance, and while never looking at a scale again. That's not just my opinion, but the reality which is all around us. If you are fat, unless you truly have some sort of metabolic dysfunction, it's because you consume too many calories, while not getting enough exercise to use them. The balance is tipped in the direction of body fat, plain and simple. It's nothing to be ashamed of, if you don't mind being fat and relatively unhealthy. I used to feel that way. I got fed up with it though and made the changes in my daily life tip the scales (figuratively speaking) back in the other direction. Before I knew it, I went from morbidly obese, to relatively height/weight proportional again. Without any fad diets (which I had done previously, unsuccessfully) and without giving up anything I love eating. Increased exercise was really the single most significant factor in my own equation. If you burn the calories, you can eat them too. If you don't, you're going to get fat, plain and simple. Sorry to ramble on so much here. It's just something I am personally passionate about, having come to understand this issue in my own life, and finding the solution. | |
| Thanks for bringing this subject up again. Last time on my topic "Body Acceptance and Fat Unhealthy Nudists" I was essentially getting at the same thing except my title was more upfront. However in your intro commentary you said basically the same thing. I still see grossley obese people in the nudist community fairly frequently, as well as in the AANR Bulletin. It is what it is. Nudists need to get more healthy. Stop the dieting yoyo. Exercise and portion based healthy eating will do it. Oh yeah, one other thing..discipline and desire to live. | |
| I for one can not find falt for ones appeearance in fact I welcome them. like anyone else. We are not ment to be cloned, or perfect in front of all our eye's. Obesity isn't all about eating and inactivity, says an international group of researchers. 1. Sleep debt. Getting too little sleep can increase body weight. Today's Americans get less shut-eye than ever. 2. Pollution. Hormones control body weight. And many of today's pollutants affect our hormones. 3. Air conditioning. You have to burn calories if your environment is too hot or too cold for comfort. But more people than ever live and work in temperature-controlled homes and offices. 4. Decreased smoking. Smoking reduces weight. Americans smoke much less than they used to. 5. Medicine. Many different drugs — including contraceptives, steroid hormones, diabetes drugs, some antidepressants, and blood pressure drugs — can cause weight gain. Use of these drugs is on the upswing. 6. Population age, ethnicity. Middle-aged people and Hispanic-Americans tend to be more obese than young European-Americans. Americans are getting older and more Hispanic. 7. Older moms. There's some evidence that the older a woman is when she gives birth, the higher her child's risk of obesity. American women are giving birth at older and older ages. 8. Ancestors' environment. Some influences may go back two generations. Environmental changes that made a grandparent obese may "through a fetally driven positive feedback loop" visit obesity on the grandchildren. 9. Obesity linked to fertility. There's some evidence obese people are more fertile than lean ones. If obesity has a genetic component, the percentage of obese people in the population should increase. 10. Unions of obese spouses. Obese women tend to marry obese men. If there are fewer thin people around — and if obesity has a genetic component — there will be still more obese people in the next generation. Researchers' list of 10 doesn't exhaust the possibilities. There may be even more explanations, including: a fat-inducing virus; increases in childhood depression; less consumption of dairy products; and hormones used in agriculture. | |
| After my wife had a stroke and had to be put on medicine, she put on a lot of weight. After several operations to fix her erratic heart beat (the cause of the stroke), she is off the medicine, but she finds it hard now to lose the weight, so I don't now assume all weight problems are a result of lifestyle (although that is a contributory factor I suppose). I do concur on two points: we should not exclude those who are overweight from enjoying nudism any more than we would ban fat people from public beaches and all people should make an effort to be physically fit for their own health benefits. That we then will enjoy the sight of them all the more is beside the point. Those who argue against nude beaches and resorts because they don't like to see fat people are just making excuses for their own reluctance to get naked socially otherwise they would be against going to just about any public textile beach because of all the fat people on those beaches. It would be like arguing for women to always wear veils in public because so many women are old and/or homely. Besides enjoying living nude, I like seeing beautiful, naked people. It would be ridiculous of me to avoid social nude settings to avoid seeing fat and ugly naked people and thereby not enjoy seeing the few beautiful naked people nor enjoy being naked myself. Oh, and by the way, the nudist resorts, because they do tend to have a high percentage of older people do have a lot of fat people. The public nude beaches that I have been to are frequented by a higher percentage of young people and so a lower percentage of fat people. | |
| I have kinda mixed feelings on this issue since obesity is not attractive, no matter the cause. Everyone should have the right to enjoy nudism, even with others. I was told about a month ago by my primary doctor I need to lose about 40 pounds to get my bloofd pressure under control. Thankfully a nursae had a good, frank discussion with me in which she told me to give up diet sodas (I was a Diet pepsi fiend who off-set any possible "benefits" with a candy bar or package of mini donuts, chips or whatever). She told me it would actually be better for me to drink regular soft drinks than diet with all the chemicals they contain. Better yet, I should and have been limiting my soft drink intake altogether though I do slip occasionally and consume one. I've already seen some weight loss without even beginning an exercise regimen which I know I need to do. The best I ever felt and looked occurred back in the late 80s and early 90s when my wife got me into jogging with her. I got my weight down to about 160 from the 180s (now I'm over 200 lbs). I know I'll definitely look more appealing to any viewer of my nude body if I shed these extra pounds but I'm having trouble getting started. It's, of course, just a matter of gritting and bearing the initial soreness to get back into moving my body forward. Jim | |
| Acutally, Calories in vs. calories out is NOT the issue. There really are differences in where you get your calories. 100 calories of sugar is way different than 100 calories from broccoli. Get the full skinny on obesity caused by sugar in this video presentation, "Sugar: The Bitter Truth" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBnniua6-oM Another major health problem is the use of GMO (Genetically Modified Organisms) ingredients. A recent lab study for the first time ever did a long-term effects study on GMO corn. All previous studies only went 90 days, but in this study it was only after a few more weeks past the initial 90 days that symptoms began to show up. Lab rats grew huge tumors so large that they would drag along the ground as the rats tried to walk. It is estimated that 90% of the corn in America is GMO. You MUST avoid this stuff like the plague! Same for Soy, and now a lot of other crops are going GMO. Go to http://www.mercola.com and look up GMO for more information on this issue. | |
| I've read a lot here, some good, some total bs. If you have a medical condition thats one thing. However MOST obese people develop medical conditions from obesity and I'm not going to name them because we all know them. Bottem line LIFESTYLE: ie, eating, sleeping amd exercise. If someone says otherwise they are full of s#%t and you can tell them I said so! | |
| Calories in vs calories out. In my post I quite specifically focused on and singled out "processed foods", "sugar" and "simple carbohydrates" as the major factors. Someone above seems to have missed those points entirely. Taking issue with the fact that I used the word "calories" is pretty much splitting hairs, especially to the point of saying that this is "NOT" the issue. How silly, when it obviously is. By the way, look up the word "calorie" in the dictionary. It's a defined unit of energy, and there aren't different types, as the above post says there are. It's a single thing. A calorie is a calorie, and if you intake too many of them (units of energy), and without consuming an equal or greater amount, your body will convert and store those excess calories to body fat. Still, let me rephrase it. If you take in more energy material (usually measured as calories) than your body needs, it will store much of this excess as body fat. The FACT is, for most people, if you eat more than your body needs for energy, compounded by a lack of exercise, you will get fat. This is self-evident. This is common sense. Watching what, and how much you eat, along with getting enough exercise is what matters, and that was my point; finding that balance. Trying to complicate this simple, obvious equation, by splitting hairs on terminology, is silly. Though it does create entire "professions" and "industries" to profit from. Genetic factors are the exception to the rule, not the rule. (I also mentioned that exception in my post) Listen, all one has to look at is the American population over the past 100 years or so. Over such a short period of time we've gone from mostly lean, to mostly FAT. Genetics don't change significantly over this time; a few generations. Only a dramatic shift in the type of food we consume, accompanied by a dramatic shift to lethargic daily lives without significant exercise, can explain this dramatic change in obesity rates in the U.S. You can also go to much of Europe and Latin America, where eating and exercise habits are much different, and you see much smaller percentages of overweight people. What has happened to Americans (including myself; a case study in this very subject) is obvious, though many people apparently can't see the forest for the trees. People love to blame things they can't change, but ignore what they can change, perhaps because they don't want to make those changes. As I take the previous post to essentially say, life is what we make it, not the other way around. Bottom line: Don't eat so much high energy food and get regular exercise. Find the right balance for your body. It's a no-brainer. | |
| This has been a great discussion and I really enjoyed reading every post. It is great food for thought for all of us and it contained no calories. so lets get out there and get healthy. Ha..winter is coming and I know i burn more calories when iam nude and its cold out...but I seem to put on wieght in the winter...This winter I will concentrate on my workouts and eating healthier. | |
| The stereotype of nudists is true. Most are elderly, fat, and not pleasant to look at. We nudists can say "that doesnt matter" all we want, but it does matter to most textiles, and young adults dont want to see grandma naked. AANR seems to find the most unhealthy and/or elderly people available to put in its newsletter. I'm not being judgmental, I'm speaking the truth and y'all know it. | |
| I'm gonna disagree. The demographic may be correct and obesity may be something that's more noticible because everyone is naked ... BUT ... the entire country is facing the fact that many people, even kids ... are obese and more so here in this country. So ... to single out "nudists" is not truthful. The fact that "younger" people don't want to look at "granma naked" is to put a truthful face on youth and what they expect to see when looking at someone naked ... what they are fed daily by magazines, TV and movies. If you're that put off by looking at granma naked ... best take a break from nudist venues cuz your head's not in the right place. As for AANR and who and what they post in the Bulletin. EVER THINK that those are the ONLY people that are willing to have their pictures taken while they are nude and have the organization post them in a publication??? It's a comfort thing, a confidence thing ... a mature thing that younger nudist seem to have little or none of either. ;) | |
| FP. The obesity rate is about 37%. Look around your nudist park sometime, I bet you'll find it around 50%. Again, we can be tolerent and accepting. I treat everyone by who they are not by what they look like. But that does not change the reality. Heck I get picked on for being skinny. If nudism is a healthy lifestyle, lots of people didnt get the memo or dont have enough self-worth to treat their bodies better. As for being "put off by looking at granma naked", I was refering to young textiles. Like it or not it's a textile world. They make the rules. Want to attract new nudists or a younger crowd? Good luck with that. People like to hang out with their generation, and who have things in common with. Will a 22 year old athletic new nudist feel comfortable in a sea of elderly lethergy? Or might they think "the stereotype is true" and move on? Older people sometimes forget what it was like to be young. ;) | |
| Percentages??? ... nudists/naturists are a microcosm of society and the obesity rates/percentages are the same. Because there are less nudists ... you'll see MORE obese people in a smaller sampling of society. You should know that! If the nudist community rate of obese people is 50% ... then as a country ... our obese rate is also 50%! Young nudist need to get over themselves. This lifestyle isn't about them. It's about living in a society within a society. For young, slim, energetic people who "like" to be nude ... doesn't necessarily make them "nudists/naturists." It's the mentality and philosophy they don't buy into because they don't want to see "granma naked." I hardly think you get as much ridicule for being skinny as those that are obese. I'm NOT an advocate for obesity and it is out of control in our country but...like many things with life and with nudism, we have choices and some people chose to be obese. I don't make my decision to be cordial or friendly based on weight and appearance. If THAT's what the younger people are doing and want. I don't want them! When the younger generation realizes that they too will grow older and not ALWAYS maintain their "athletic" appearances ... they will learn what life is about. The "older" people haven't forgotten what's it was like to be young. The younger people have never been taught tolerance and respect! ;) | |
| Yeah, FP, being condescending to young people is a great way to welcome them into the lifestyle. LOL. "Those darn young whippersnappers and their zest for life! Dagnabbit!" LOL. If you want young people to accept YOU, you must accept THEM as well. You were young once, remember? Maybe not. And getting older does NOT mean loosing athleticism. That attitude is one reason why we have an obesity problem. Is nudism a healthy lifestyle? Prove it! Get healthy, make the stereotype wrong. And yes I get picked on for being skinny MORE than obese people at my resort. It is verboten to talk badly of obesity but perfectly acceptable to do so about skinny. Makes me self-consious sometimes. Cant blame young/skinny/atheletic people for leaving when they are made to feel uncomfortable. | |
| Armadillo, you misunderstood FP's comments. He is in no way condescending toward youth. He often discusses the need for oldster to be more accepting of youth. He has undergone at least two foot surgeries this past year, one foot at a time, and no doubt suffers other wear and tear from his years as a professional firefighter. At least according to what I've read, FP loves youngsters and wants them to enjoy nudity with and among mixed sexes and ages. In fact, his own daughters and their families have participated in nude vacations with them. Other young people have happily hung out nude with him and his wife at their home. There really is no better avocate for young nudists, in my limited experience, than FP. His wife is a bit socially shy and so isn't as open about it as he is. Jim | |
| I think some of this has to do with where you live as well. I am from So. Cal coast and more people are into running going to a gym and eating healthy. I now live in rural Montana. Ive never seen more unhealthy fat people in all my life. The stats show places like Mississippi and Alabama to have the highest obiesty rates. All the points here are valid. Fast food engineered foods are killing this country. Lack of exercise all that contributes to this sad phenominum. Something about being nude 90% of the time just makes me want to eat healthier and stay in shape. I have to look at myself and I dont want to become a diabetic so I do what I need to do. I would hope that all nudists would do more to live healtier lifestyles. | |
| Sun, I think you're right about location playing a major role in the healthiess and lifestyle of the residents. I'm from the land of endless buffets (don't even really like visiting them much anymore)and Las Vegas is full of obse people. Lots of smokers and drinkers too. Many are visitors but there ar lots of residents who fit the mold too. Jim | |
| Well, I went to my GYN earlier today for a routine visit. They weighed me, and interestingly enough, I've lost 13 pounds. In 12 weeks. As I stated in my earlier post, I have a neurological condition that prevents me from working out. I'm not supposed to lift more than 8 lbs. I'm not supposed to do anything that puts a strain on my neck. The condition I have is called cervical dystonia (or spasmodic torticollis). Basically, the nerves cause the muscles to pull in abnormal (and quite painful) positions. There are some treatments, and they work with varying degrees of effectiveness and duration. The treatment I opted for was surgical. The affected nerves are identified, isolated, and a section of that nerve is cut out. Yes, it's a drastic measure, but it beats the alternative of not having the surgery. Because of my surgery, my exercise options are limited. Even walking can bother my neck. I do eat healthy; baked chicken, steamed or raw veggies, fruit, brown rice, whey protein shakes. Is there a point to all this? Perhaps. To look at me, you would think I'm overweight (which I am), and that I don't take care of myself (which I do). You can't see my dystonia. You can't see the scars from my surgery, which are hidden by my hair. If you look at me closely, and for long enough, you might notice my head pulls to the left, I have trouble looking to the right, and that my right shoulder is lower than my left. It's not immediately obvious, because in 12 years, I've learned to stand in such a way that most people don't notice. I would hate for someone to think I'm lazy and fat, and stuff my face with junk food. Granted, that is true for some overweight and obese people, but not all. My brother was "husky" as a boy, and gained more and more weight as he got older. He was put on medications, and nothing seemed to help. Turns out it was an allergic reaction to dust and grass pollen, of all things. My .05 worth... YMMV, of course. | |
| Blah Blah Blah... I like cookies and I eat them. Ah just having a little fun with y'all. This has been a good, spirted and thought provoking discussion. We have not had one like this in a while. Good job folks, keep it up. This is an issue that has so many viewpoints and representations in the nudist arena. Let's keep going... who have we not heard from??? | |
| Condescending????? You need a course in reading comprehension! LOL It's too bad Armadillo gets ridiculed for being skinny. Sorry the people at YOUR club are that narrow-minded but because they are ... EVERY club and nudist venue must be the same way. Hmmmmm ... I think not. There have been many a young nudist here that have argued "their" points but ... what they haven't done is understood the points of those that are over 40! They want a "party" atmosphere, video games and someone else to organize them and provide activities for them. It's no different in the textile community. Those youngsters don't want to be patient, work for anything or do anything ... they want it all and they want it now. Good luck...cuz the generation your bucking ... had to do just that; be patient, work for what they got and got it by doing it themselves and getting involved. They want change ... I tell them to get off their skinny, athletic butts and get involved! :D | |
| Over 40 and overweight. Yep, that describes me and my wife. Let's see: Don't care I've gone from 213 lbs October of 2011 to 190 lbs this year. My wife has gone from 268 lbs to 216 lbs in the same time frame. Yeah, we eat whatever we want whether it is a hamburger, pizza, candy, snacks, or whatever. We've learned to control the SIZE of the portions we eat. Are we changing other things about how/what we eat? Yep! I do all the cooking and baking (very little of that). I use little or no salt. We have cut WAY down on the amount of meat we eat. What has prompted this? I have had my wife in the hospital 5 times this year (2012, only). She nearly died in January. Why is she heavy? Fibromyalgia, Lupus, pacemaker for nearly 30 years, CHF (because her heart has degenerated), COPD (we are told that it goes hand-in-hand with CHF), cardia meglea (I probably spelled both of those wrong, it means an enlargement of the heart also from degeneration f the heart), and Stroke (TIAs). Can she exercise? She had a physical therapist coming once a week to help her exercise. The exercise was causing her more pain (not exercise related pain) than she could tolerate. What is the point of this post? When I graduated high school, I was on a weight gain diet and exercise regimen which gained me 20 lbs in three years. I was underweight and undersized for my age. I have been up to 250 lbs. Armadillo, just wait, your time is coming. I've been there where I was teased and ridiculed for being skinny. Now, I have jerks doing the same because I'm overweight. My metabolism changed almost overnight when I was about 35, my normal body temperature went down, my ability to throw off illness also went down (thank goodness my susceptibility to illness didn't increase). I see you are just BARELY over 40. You have not yet had experiences that have changed your mind set. You see a fat person ANYWHERE around you (textiled or otherwise) get over it! As Lacy and myself have pointed out from personal experience, you know nothing about us or why we are like we are. You expect us to give you a break and accept you without knowing you, and we should! But YOU should be just as accepting of us John | |
| Ladys and gentlemen my post might have seemed a little smug but the point was to get those who read it and may be on the fence about getting started with a diet and exercise plan to move their butts. A mentor of mine once said that beside viral or bacterial, it will soon be proven that most of what ails us stems from our eating habits. I see this everyday in my own practice. So step one: LEARN TO EAT "CLEAN"! | |
| Caloires in vs. calories out NakedHikerNW, feel free to address me by name instead of "someone" who posted something... Obviously, you did not yet watch the video I posted "Sugar: The Bitter Truth". This is not just some dude with an opinion, this is Robert H. Lustig, MD, UCSF Professor of Pediatrics in the Division of Endocrinology, who is qualified to make the statement in contrast to your statement of "calories in vs. calories out". I am also well versed in thermodynamics and know the definition of calorie. Your position completely ignores the way the body handles different foods, and is in direct contradiction with your own other statement you made, but with which I agree with you and did not ignore, that processed foods and junk foods are major factors in the nation wide shift in health. The video specifically debunks the "calories in vs. calories out" myth. | |
| I have no interest in continuing "tit for tat" with you, "Sanman" (I didn't bother to pay attention to "who" said it, I just referred to what was said). This is what so often happens on online message boards. Ho hum. I offered my take on things. You disputed it, and I offered a clarification and rebuttal. Enough. You're obviously hung up on my very first words of "calories in vs calories out" and haven't been able to see beyond those words to comprehend anything else I've said after that, which was to explain in great deal what that means to me. Bottom line (again): If you take in more fuel (typically measured in calories) than your body needs, it will often store that excess fuel as body fat. It's a matter of balance. That you continue to dispute, or perhaps ignore this point is, to me, mind-boggling. You're so focused on those first few words, which was really only a way of stating something in terms that everyone can relate to, that you can't see the forest for the trees here. Your splitting hairs and condemning my posts doesn't change this point of my posts at all, which I further clarified in great deal beyond those first few words, even using alternate terms in hopes of getting past your myopic criticism of my posts. As I said, some people love to complicate things beyond belief, while ignoring common sense and what is right before everyone's eyes. Keep it simple. That's a phrase I think I've heard somewhere. As I also pointed out, many people have a financial stake in doing so, especially doctors and other so-called "professionals" who are making a living by doing so, as you apparently do as a self-proclaimed personal trainer or something. You need to keep things complicated so that people think they need you to do something that is just common sense otherwise. Eat smart and get regular exercise. I don't need a personal trainer to tell me that. Some people obviously do. As for me, I have no financial stake in this at all. And with that, I'm done with this topic. Feel free to have "the last word", which I'm quite sure you will want to do, given the personality which you have now made very clear. It won't change my point at all, and I really couldn't care less. I won't even come back to this topic to read what is further posted, since at this point it has already been very well covered, as the author concluded here already. This is what is so disappointing about online forums, where I think all opinions are supposed to be welcome. Someone offers just such an opinion on a topic, in this case backed with personal experience, and someone else has to not just disagree with that opinion, but get self-righteously aggressive, if not nasty, in their responses. Okay, Mr Expert. Have a nice day. | |
| Wow, the hostility. I've never encountered such a reaction in any other naturist forum before. You accuse me of not reading your points, to which I did actually acknowledge and agree with the part of what you said, that junk foods (processed stuff) was bad, and the only thing I took exception to was your claim of calories in vs. calories out. This is an old mantra that is simply wrong. Sure, on the surface, and if all other things being equal, it would be right, but the point you seemed to have missed is that not all sources of calories are handled the same way in the body. There is a huge difference between 100 calories from sugar and 100 calories from broccoli. In your first post on this thread, you specifically said it was as SIMPLE as calories in vs. calories out, but that is simply not true. I too do not have any financial stake in what I'm saying here. In fact, how in the world do you think anyone could make money by telling them to reduce their sugar intake? I posted a link to a video explaining the biological process of digestion of sugar in the body and what it does to you, but I wonder if you even bothered to check it out. I am also not a physical trainer, so I have no idea what you're getting at with that. | |
| As the debate turns vitriolic (LOL!), I guess I'll throw in my 2 cents. At 175 lbs and 5'10, with an all-over tone (tan too), I guess you could say I'm physically well-balanced. This is due to two things: the metabolism of a freight train, and a training regimen I've maintained for about 20 years. The first is purely genetic, and therefore out of my control. The second is totally my choice. And about choice...I chose to maintain a Spartan physique because it's important to me. For others, it's more important to make money - or spend time with family - or spend all their spare time relaxing nude. I will not begrudge anyone's lifestyle choice. Sometimes physical complications occur that prevent strenuous physical activity. That too is understandable. But...what gets my goat is when "body acceptance" is used as an excuse for laziness. Yes, no obese person will be turned away from the resort gates or thrown off the beach. That's true. But that should never be interpreted to mean: "nudists don't care what I look like, and therefore I don't have to care either." That's just lazy. And not to end my post on a vitriolic note, personal choice or not, acceptance or not, no one enjoys seeing Bibendum (aka Michelin Man) walking up and down the beach or sitting on the edge of the hottub. Perhaps a little harsh, but also a little true. | |
| Hmmmmm ... so do some of you go to nudist venues to look and enjoy bodies... or do you go to nudist venues to enjoy the freedom of naturism? "Nobody enjoys seeing the Michelin Man or Woman walking down the beach..." seems pretty shallow. We have a very close nudist friend, in fact, she and her husband are coming next weekend to stay for a few days. He body type is of that you describe. She walks around the house and our backyard naked from the time they put their suitcases down ... because we don't judge her on her appearance but her mind, soul and heart. She does have medical conditions but ... how did we know that? When we met, we didn't ask her ... "do you have a medical condition that causes you to be obese?" She won our hearts and friendship because of the person she is ... NOT what she looks like. We found out much later ... a couple years later that she has medical and physical issues that preclude her from strainuous exercise ... and she eats like a freakin' bird! How do you know what condition these obese people have? I've stated that I'm no advocate for obesity and that I've seen some of the more obese people at our club eat what they shouldn't BUT ... as you stated, it's their choice. I don't judge because in all honesty, "they" were the first ones to accept me as a single when I visited the club. They were friendlier than the "skinny" residents and members. THAT's what I look for and enjoy ... not enjoying watching someone saunder down the beach or pool deck. I'm not accusing you of doing such but ... it seems strange for someone that has preached acceptance in many other posts, to now focus on a nudists physical appearance, rather than who they are, in your last post. Your Spartan physique is due to you "freight train" metabolism, isn't it possible that some of these obese people have the metabolism of a "row boat?" Is it possible that these people have tried diets and eveything short of surgery to lose weight but either find it deflating, long and see almost no results ... that they give up? Is that wrong? Is that not human nature? Is it not something that we've all done? How many physically fit nudists wanted to be millionaires? When you didn't attain it ... did you settle into a job that made you enough to enjoy life? You made that choice ... just as these people have made theirs. It doesn't make them a bad person and they are cetainly not saundering on the beach or pool deck for anyone's "enjoyment" except their own. ;) | |
FireProf, I seem to always enjoy your post and this last one as well. You just seem so in tune with most people. I am one of those "Obese" people that is a nudist. I have not asked to be this way, and it is not something that I am overly proud of. It just is what it is. Part of it is genetic and I do eat like a bird and I am not lazy. I am also sick of knowing what others usually think of me. So to that point I am lazy, because I don't care what they think of what I look like. I like the real me and so does my huband, and children. I am sad that others don't want to know the real me. The ones that have the problem with me are shallow and I DON"T CARE. | |
| oddbutterfly, "...I don't care what they think of what I look like," does NOT make you lazy! "I like the real me and so does my huband, and children," shows that you are well balanced in you acceptance of yourself and of others. Actually, such acceptance takes a LOT of personal work. Another thing, you are right about FP. He usually hits the nail on the head! These folks that judge others for "saundering on the beach or pool deck" are too shallow and narrow minded to learn anything about human nature or to allow other people to be human while they, the narrow minded, DEMAND that no one be judgmental of them. As FP said, the "obese" are "they are cetainly not saundering on the beach or pool deck for anyone's 'enjoyment' except their own." | |
| SB, I've thought about this for a couple of days. You may think it's "a bit of fun", but I saw nothing funny or humourous. Some of the responses offended me, and I'm not easily offended. I would give anything to be like I was before I developed dystonia. I would love to have my old life back. Not everyone who is overweight is just lazy and eats junk food all day, which it appears that people here seem to think. So much for being "open minded and accepting"... | |
| And that's why I usually shy away from these topics; and I still don't know why I contributed to this one. A dare, perhaps. Of all the nudist taboos, "nudist esthetics" is probably the biggest taboo. Particularily in our Western PC culture. There have been plenty of studies about this: people will gravitate towards the most charimastic or attractive individuals. I never said it didn't suck. If you have Salma Hayek sitting on one edge of the pool, and Kirstie Alley (no offense to her) on the other...if you're a guy you're probably going to notice a lot more of Salma. It's ok to admit it, really. It's only human. I never said I wasn't accepting of everyone - as contradictory as it might sound right now. My best nudist friend was obese; it never bothered me in the slightest. I have socialized with nudists indiscriminately of race, age or weight; as long as they're nude like me, that's good enough for me. But I do have a sense of esthetics, like most people do. For me to say that when I'm nude I suddenly "become blind" or can't tell the difference between what's attractive and unattractive to me would be hypocritical ludicrousness. I know the paradox of being accepting of everyone, yet still having personal preferences may seem...paradoxal; yet, I think at some level we all carry that paradox. Salma Hayek...hmmm.... | |
| Thank you for your reasoned response FireProf. I can't think of anything to add to it. | |
| Nudony, We've bantered on several topics and not agreed on too many. That's okay ... even my Wing Woman ( SB) ... or maybe I'm "her" Wing Man ... hehehe don't agree on everything. The point is ... this lifestyle, for some, is still about asthetics and exterior beauty and that's not what we preach to everyone that asks about it and that's not what many of us believe. If Salma is on the pool deck and thinks as you do ... she won't give me the time of day. But if Kirstie is on the pool deck and I initiate a conversation, she'll probably talk to me til my ears fall off. There's more to beauty than the exterior. I've known many a exterior beautiful women that were the ugliest people I've ever met. I bet I can say with enough fact that many obese people don't appear friendly because of the way people treat them or ignore them ... in mainstream society and within the nudist community. You made mention of your size, weight and your Spartan physique ... why was that so important? In my opinion, because that's where your head is at times and it's contradictory of what I've read from you before. ;) | |
| Nudony, yours was one of the more offensive responses. Especially the comment about body acceptance being an excuse for laziness. I am not lazy. I have a neurological condition that prevents me from being able to exercise or workout. That's why I said I'd give anything to be like I was before my dystonia. I live in pain EVERY SINGLE MINUTE OF EVERY SINGLE DAY. It's not as bad as it was before my surgery, but I deal with it. Without pain medication. Because short of a morphine pump (and I'm not even sure that would work), *NOTHING* touches the pain. Not Percodan, Not even Oxycontin. Yeah, I've tried both. I'm not supposed to lift more than 8 lbs, nothing 5 lbs, or over, over my head. Think about that for a second, and let it sink it. I can't lift a 5 lb bag of sugar over my head. Exercises put strain on my neck, even walking. You don't realize how much affects your neck until you have something like this. Go to http://www.dystonia-foundation.org/pages/cervical_dystonia/45.php, click the surgery link in the treatments description of the condition, then click on the "Bertrand Procedure" link. I had my surgery in May of 2004. I had 5 nerves affected, the surgeon was only about to cut 4. 2 of the nerves control the muscles which allow me to hold my head up. If he had cut both, I wouldn't have been able to hold my head upright. You may look at me and see me as fat and lazy. I wouldn't wish my condition on my worst enemy. Have you ever had a really bad kink in your neck? Imagine that pain, multiply the pain by about 1000, AND it never goes away. That's what I live with on a daily basis. Try to workout with that pain. Until you've walked a mile in my shoes, don't judge me. And don't you dare call me lazy. Yeah, I'm pissed off. | |
| Applause for Lacy!!!!! As I've posted before, I don't have a whole lot wrong with me but my wife does, Frbro, Lupus, CHF, COPD, to name a few. I've watched her try to just go for a walk and I've had to go get the car and come pick her up when she has collapsed (she sits down rather than fall down). We have been shopping and she has had to sit down. I don't ALLOW her to do much walking along those lines anymore, she just plain can't. This is not the first time this subject has been discussed on this site and EVERYTIME it is brought up it is done so by some near-sighted, close-minded, so-n-so that says, "Don't get me wrong, I don't mind the ..." Like hell you don't or you wouldn't start the discussion. I not pissed like Lacy but I WILL defend my wife! | |
| I'm with you on that Lacey. The Dr. asks "where is your pain level?" I, too live with a 9 or 10 DAILY! If I really hurt, it's NOT on the scale! it's 14-16. People who don't live with pain can't comprehend what some of us deal with everyday, and NO drugs! There are parts of me that I wish were 'firmer' but it's not happening. I can't bend or stretch those places, period. I do like me the way I am, and anybody else can "suck rocks" !!!! | |
| Lacy, I don't think you know enough about me or the role of a moderator to beat me about my comment of levity of this type of forum not the subject. If you are pissed, you are pissed for the wrong reasons. I don't beleive I have ever told you that you pissed me off, please do not tell me that either. This group is based on challenging discussions because those are what make you think and not to be defensive about or get you pissed about. I believe we learn from being challenged, not from being pissed. Whenever I get pissed about something, I try to understand why I am pissed and I almost always move forward in the context of the issue. I don't need to walk in your shoes nor do I want to. You have not walked in mine either and I don't want you to. That is personalization at the highest level. Topics like this always get very personal and passionate because people want to personalize it with emotions or predjudice. This topic and the one like before that I posted were both clear about it not including health issue. Yet, once again it has entered into the discussion. To me what is trying to be addressed are those people who are overweight or unheathy becasue of choice they make in their lives. I want everyone I meet or befriend to be health and happy. Almost everyone I meet that has extreme weight issues due to their own actions are almost nefver healthy or happy. I do believe that some of these nudists do run to the body acceptance theme because they can bury the actions and not worry or even think about confronting the issues for their OWN good. Ok, they are trying to fell better about themselves but that is just a bandaid and not the solution. Not wearing clothes may even be more comfortable, ok I get that too. Whatever is the case, I don't know and I don't care. I do what I do, they can do what they want to do. I have had snippy comments from some of these people very directly pointed at me and the words were mean and hurtful. I could have very easily stooped to that level in response but I choose to ignore them because that is more powerful. I don't accept their comments and that is my choice. I will probably be around longer than they will, but again that is their decision, not mine | |
| I'm pissed because I know what I've lived with, and through, for the past 12 years. I've seen my body change over the course of my disease. I don't like the change, but there's nothing that can be done about it. Johns Hopkins is researching DBS (Deep Brain Stimulation) for dystonia. Right now, results are mixed. DBS is a radical surgery, not to be undertaken lightly. It is brain surgery. A couple years ago, I went to Hopkins for a consult on it. At that time, I wasn't a candidate for it. Perhaps in a few more years, I might be. To the ones that have made the ugly and inconsiderate comments, I don't ever want to know you. You've shown how shallow you really are. As I said, I wouldn't wish this on anyone, but I would love to see the fit, hard body, Adonis types in this conversation deal with just 10% of my pain for one day. They'd be singing a different tune, then. | |
| And my point, SB, is you shouldn't judge. I eat healthy. But because of my neck, I can't exercise, so even healthy food adds weight if I'm sedentary. My brother was overweight, and he led an active lifestyle. He was overweight because of an allergy. It only took 46 years to diagnose it. Now he's on allergy medication and has lost 200 pounds. Until his diagnosis, you would have thought he was just fat and lazy, and stuffed his face with junk food. He wasn't. So by just looking, you make assumptions. Unless you see the overweight or obese person chowing down on 12 large Double Whopper combos, you just don't know. I'm overweight and I do not put junk in my body. The no junk thing is why I don't take pain meds, even though I live with pain on a constant basis. | |
| Geez...I knew I should have never posted... SB said "Topics like this always get very personal and passionate because people want to personalize it with emotions or prejudice. This topic and the one like before that I posted were both clear about it not including health issue." And that's also exactly what I stated in my first post. Perhaps, my "Michelin man" euphemism and attempt at cynicism was a little too much and insensitive. So I will retract it. It was meant as a joke and it obviously failed as some people took it personally. I also emphasized the fact that I had friends, nudist and textile, of all ages sizes and shape. Yet the wave of indignation rising against me seemed to take no heed of that fact. Some people have now undoubtebly pegged me as an a-hole for expressing my sentiment; and so be it if that's the case. Yet no one in the "real" nudist world has accused me of being one, which seems to me much more significant. There is no doubt that the topic is VERY personal and inflammatory for many people. And that there is a deep trench between people's personal beliefs and value system when it comes to "how to live." But taking it personally, in this instance seems futile. This is the internet, where people say the randomnest things, say what they don't mean and are otherwise misinterpreted. And no FP, I'm not a meathead who only cares about his biceps size and the measurements of the women at the nude beach. I'd think our many online encounters and exchanges would have proved that by now. And I think, if memory serves, that our agreement/disagreement ratio is more like ....hmm...40/60. And as far a willfully ignoring Salma at the resort...err...yeaahh... (I'm joking!) ;) | |
| One of the things this discussion and others like it show is that the ones who find us "overweight blimps" (an imprecise quote) disgusting are the young fit ones (not necessarily you, Sunman) who have not yet reached the age where their metabolisms have slowed down or their ability to get up and move has diminished. The young are almost always judgmental. As a youth (teenager) I had a friend who had been a steveadore for his working career. He had been muscled like a weight lifter. After he aged where he couldn't keep up the lifting and his back gave way, his skin began to sag. He wasn't fat, obese, or in anyway overweight. As a matter of fact, he was underweight and the doctors were concerned because they couldn't get him to gain weight. He would hold his arm straight out to the side of his body and the skin of his upper arm would droop nearly to his waist. You could say that he was disgusting until you got to know him. Those of you who judge by the appearance of a person whether that person is the way they are by their own actions or through no fault of their own (i.e. health issues) are the ones that lose out. You are the ones that are shallow, close, and narrow minded. Your day WILL come. | |
| ok I give up... some of you just do not get it or better yet do not want to get it. Your choice, whatever. Through one of the other topics on Absolute it was brought to light that the vast majority of people on this group are not even part-time nudists nor have ever been to a nudist venue. The home nudist thing doesn't cut it when you talk about social nudity. I heard clearly what Sunofabeach was getting at when he said you see the extremely overweght people at many nudist venues and in pictures in the AANR Bulletin. Besides living in a nudist venue, I have visited a number of them on extended stays and guess what...I have seen the same type of people. Do I judge them and critize them, no. Do I enjoy seeing people who are extremely over weight for whatever reasons, no. Should I be the enabler and help them justify why they are over weight, no. Beleive me I have heard a lot of justifications. I am pretty good at reading through the BS and a lot of it is BS. When a guy, this is an actual experience, lumbers his 300+ pound body full of stretch marks and discoloration over my head when I am leaning back in a lounge chair poolside, it is disgusting. In that event it was purposeful because he could have easily gone in another direction. Whatever jollies he got, I sure didn't and this is the type of activities that occur. So maybe there is a reason for some hostility towards some of these people. They are disrepectful. Most of the one'e I have encountered were not happy people. I never have an issue (nor judge) with anyone who is over weight as long as the are nice and respectful. I do wish that if they could lead healthier lifstyles they would, but I learned long ago you can't want something more for someone than they want it for themselves. Can we all take a deep breath, drop the personalizing, and just talk about this in an open and positive manner. If you really don't think you can... don't respond please | |
| Very well said SunBunny and I am sorry for my 300+ pound body full of stretch marks and discoloration over your head when you were leaning back in a lounge chair poolside. It was an ACCIDENT :-) P.S. I respect ALL your topics of conversation here at NCH and you represent a REAL nudist and Nudsit values | |
| Time for another Rodney King moment...can't we just all get along? | |
| The main reason I posted a video link about sugar was because a lot of people who are overweight is basically because they've been poisoned unaware. It is nearly impossible to eat healthy in the USA any more. Food may look the same today as it did 50 years ago, but nutritionally it is wildly different! There is an epidemic nearly world-wide, but more prevalant in the USA of nearly inexplicable weight gain, unless one looks at the quality of food we're offered. Even when one tries to eat helathy, often the food chosen is actually making their condition worse because the supposed "healthy food" has been modified to such an extent that it's no longer healthy. As you can see, this then is not a lack of will-power, or because of lazyness, or often not even genetic. The "food industry" is the true culprit for the majority of obesity in America, because they have poisoned our food supply. | |
| Okay ... back on track. What is nudism/naturism? In the beginning it was about a healthy, well toned body, clean living and healthy eating. Nude Beauty Pagents were held and documented in early magazines. Time has changed and mindsets and philosophies have changed. You can't paddle your kids behind anymore without fear of the cops or dept. of child services being called. The younger generation used to show respect to elders they didn't know, nowadays ... they think they are their equal. Technology has changed. Kids texting each other instead of talking with one another. Everyone's in a hurry and need, what they want, yesterday ... that includes food on the go. And ... ya know what? ALL this includes the very people, the older generation, that is doing the complaining about the younger generation. "I didn't do that", "I wasn't brought up that way," "that's not the way we used to do that," "back in the ol' days..." sorry folks, those "days" are OVER and we let them slip away because we were too whimpy to fight to keep those "mindsets and philosophies." Think about the way you were raised, how you raised your kids and how your grandchildren are being raised ... if you don't see a dramatic difference ... you're foolin' yourselves ... and you bought into it! Nudism isn't full of obese people, it's not made up of "cool" people, nudists aren't the friendliest people, ALL these people were already obese, cool, friendly and became nudists. There are jerks, idiots, bigots, racists, diveats, perverts ... also within our ranks and we are afraid to admit it ... sometimes. Am I more offended by an obese person standing over me than I am a well toned hard body standing over me? I'd probably not be offended by either as long as I knew their intentions. Just as an example of SB's incident: Is it less offensive to have a 300+ lb, nice, friendly guy standing over you wanting to be friends and ask you questions regarding ... whatever, or a well toned, young guy standing over you with his genitals within a foot or two from your face wanting more than friendship!? WHAT is/was the intent of the person standing over you, sitting next to you, taking a route by you? The intent of many a nudist/naturist, young, old, overweight, toned/trim, skinny or obese is always up for interpretation from your mind to theirs and even here on these sites, topics and pages of posts ... intent and interpretation gets murky. I get the OP's intent of his inquiry. It boils down to aesthetics, what's pleasing to our eye and what is not. If a well toned, weight proportioned man or woman is seen eating a double cheeseburger, fries and chocolate shake ... no one thinks about whether or not they are eating healthy. But if an overweight, obese person does the same, they are looked upon quite differently, with disgust, annoyance and bigotry. It's not fair, it's certainly not what "WE" as nudists/naturists have had as a mindset and philosophy for quite sometime. Those ol' days are over and for this nudist, it's truly become about acceptance of all and not just those physically pleasing to the eye. So ... where do we begin and where do we stop? Obese people ... OUT! Tatted people ... OUT! Pierced people ... OUT! People with red hair, black hair, brown hair, NO hair ... OUT! Women with augmented breasts ... OUT! People of color (hell ... they don't need a tan anyway) ... OUT! Conservatives (they claim to be conservative but like to be naked ... hmmmm) OUT! Liberals (all they want to do is give things away) OUT! How much or how little pubic hair one sports (who makes that ruling?) OUT ... depending on amount, length and/or shape! Generalized statements are always a bad idea and get you into a corner you can't get out of. The best part of this lifestyle and what brought many of us into it was the acceptance of others, their philosophies, their opinions and their differences. Who makes the decisions on who and what defines a nudist we ALL want to look at and those we do not? As for the publications that post pics of overweight nudists ... where are the "skinny" nudists? Where are the "young" nudists? Why aren't their pictures in these publications??? Because they aren't comfortable enough in their own skin to have their pics taken or have them published. Older nudists that have lived the life they chose and suffered the consequences of a poor diet, inactivity for one reason or another, medical and physical ailments that kept them from exercise and inactivity are still those that are involved, voluteering to do what many of the "young, well toned, physically fit" people in nudism are unwilling to do. Do you actually think AANR, N magazine and many other nudist publications are singling out obese nudists to pose for pictures? They'd love nothing more than to show a true cross section of naturism ... BUT ... where are the young nudists, why won't they let their pictures be taken and published ... why aren't THEY involved and volunteering? Is the OP suggesting that there are young nudists just standing in line to have their pictures taken and be published in the naturist periodicals but the editors only want obese people? For me ... I want someone's who willing to get involved and contribute and from what I've seen from first hand experience and from what I see and read ... it's usually the overweight, obese, older, and confident nudist and very little from the well toned, young and those that are in this for aesthetics instead of substance. Apologies for the long post. ;) | |
| Thank you all for taking a deep breath and starting to move forward in a more positive fashion. I know it is difficult sometimes and all of our lives are filled with issues that we deal with and work through. I remain hopeful that some of the responses to topics on this group can be a helping piece of a puzzle to things we all deal with dailey. I truly want us all to be supportive of each other and enjoy social nudism as a way of living. Thanks again everybody. Now for a little commentary on the latest responses (sorry I could not resist): Brett: I don't think that was you, really really unless you reversed the ageing process and if you did can you share the secret to doing that. On second thought, forget it, I like my age. Smile, it looks good on you. FireProf: So much for getting back on track, I am just not sure what track you are on. LOL, cause you seemed to address about three (maybe four) different topics here on AN. Good commentary and appreciated. At times like this I seeem to recall a song by the 5th Dimension named Aquarius. Good job Wingman. Sanman: By your posts it was clear to me that you are passionate about healthy living. I have read your suggestions and thoughts carefully but I kept feeling like I was being preached to. Perhaps others did as well. I would encourage you to post a topic that provides an avenue for group members to give their thoughts or experiences on TIPS for leading a healthy lifestyle. That way everybody can share and not just hear from the teacher. We all have experiences, some big some small, but they are all valuable just the same. I think this would be a positive way to address the main thrust of this topic. Give it some thought please. ok, Jedi Master over and out! | |
| What an interesting thought-provoking topic! I am very much in two minds when seeing obese people at the nudist resort. One half of me wants to scream at these people when I see them piling their food high at the all-you-can-eat buffet. The other half of me admires them for having the courage to show all of themselves: fat, beer bellies, stretch marks and all. Their daring made it much easier for me to become a nudist -- any worries about how I myself looked completely vanished. However I would be more comfortable if I saw a healthier lifestyle being adopted by visitors to the resorts. Perhaps it's a matter of individual choice, but it's a pretty obvious choice if the alternative is to look like the Michelin-tire man, to risk type-2 diabetes, to have clogged arteries, etc. | |
| FP's comment brings to mind another interesting point: the generation gap. Boomers, Gen Xers and Gen Yers have their own "take" on nudity and body acceptance, based on their own socio-cultural paradigms. It will be interesting to see how this all plays out over the next 10-20 years. Will a more "enlightened" kind of nudism surface; will it become hedonistic? Or will it just fade out? Stay tuned... | |
| Nudony, I predict that nudism as it currently exists will be extinct in a generation. The old-timers are dying off and there are fewer youngsters to replace them. Younger people have different expectations and values than older people. Nudism can adapt or die. I expect the "new nudism" to be more free (fewer rules) and healthier. | |
| Nudony & Armadillo, this a great subject for a different topic post. I think it would be a very good and interesting issue to discuss. Can one of you please think about maybe formulating the question and posting it. Group memebrs, Can we please get back to this topic please? thank you. SB | |
| FP, great post. And SunBunny, I agree too. | |
| Hi all just a few words from a bbw yes I am a big beautiful woman … from what I can see from what I have read a lot of u assume that fat ppl eat 2 much and don’t care about themselves I think that is judging ppl don’t u ? …. U find a lot of slim ppl who don’t look after themselves and can eat more food than a fat person … I was slim once lol a good long time back... ok u may think wow so why let yourself go .. actually I didn’t let myself go … I have got over many cancer ops and I have cancer now and fighting it … so all medication over the years has not helped ( but rather b big and happy and alive).. But u know what... im proude 2 b me... I live a good healthy life style eat plenty of fruit and veg and walk every day and exercise when I can in-between treatments .. I have a disabled son who keep me very active … I could tell u more but I like 2 keep some parts of my life pvt I don’t see why I should tell ppl things 2 prove that not all FAT ppl r lazy , unhealthy .. but it seems some ppl like 2 judge others without getting 2 know them and what there life is like .. and regards to seeing fat ppl at resorts .. why not take time out and get 2 know them before u judge them … u never know u might find some ppl interesting …. Tc all xx | |
| I'm with u cyn. I am also a cancer survisor. While goingm through treatments my energy level was absorbed. I became sedentary out of necessity. I gained weight. I am still fighting th weight thing. I am not a veteran nudist,b but recently visited Oaklake Trails. I was not treated as fat. The people I met were the were so nice. As for cyn, I've met her in the chat room. She has a great sense ofr humer and a lovely personality. So who gives a shit wether she is "overweight". And that's all I have to say about that. | |
| I just made a post, but I,m not thru. The comments made about overweight people are unacceptable. Bunny I am offended by this forum. what are we here for? to show off our wonderful muscles or to be naked to rid ourselves of the bias of beauty and what society haS taught us. Bunny, your a friendly looking girl, you have a pretty presence, but like most of us you do not have as perfect body. So please encourage the members here to accept cyn as a beautiful person that she is. | |
| ok the subject was not about me but in a way it is ( im a so called obese person )and we do have a good number of big ppl on the site .. and i disagree that only looking thin can mean you are healthy , there are many ppl who i think you would call obese to be healthy ... naturism is not just for models its for normal human beings and there freedome of the life style | |
| Yes, all should feel free and should be welcome to join the nudist community, regardless of appearances. Jim | |
| Yeah, well, Jim, that's all well and good, but I've pretty much abandoned this group because of the ugliness of this thread. It was one of my favorite groups, but not anymore. I don't even read it that much. I happened to see your comment, which prompted me to post, but you'll notice since my last post in this thread, I have not participated here. I just don't feel welcome or accepted in AN anymore. It's also changed my feeling about the website, to an extent. | |
| I think this has been a very good and honest discussion. Yes there have been a few bumps and scrapes along the way but that is what sometimes happens when you have honest discussions. I always prefer to know someones honest feeling about a subject rather than some PC boring gobblygook. That way I know where their head is and I can deal with it as suits me best. This is the manner in which I moderate this group and I tend to believe is what makes it the most popular and active group on NCH. Maybe some of you ought to read the original subject posting again then read our mantra again. If you are offended by this subject you have probably taken this and other subjects personally rather than intellectually. We are here to learn from each other and respect each others opinions and experiences. I think we have done that. | |
| I had no idea posting this topic would spark such a heated discussion. It obviously strikes a cord. I feel bad that feelings have been hurt and personal relations have been fractured. That certainly was not my intent. However this has been a great discussion and I hope we have all learned something and that most of us come away better educated and perhaps more accepting of others. Whats the saying...dont go away mad...just go away....haha just kidding. Hey...eat healthy..be healthy in mind and spirit. Love your neighbor and stay naked! | |
| I'm on several other sites. One is very cordial and quite "vanilla." We don't discuss many "controversial" topics. There are groups here that fit that same mold but they are very quiet and very little communication for long periods of time. Yeah ... ya all know that SB and I have become "friends" and we can post our opinions and question your's but ... we do our damnest to be honest and because of that honesty ... SB and I don't ALWAYS agree ... but the fact is, we both enjoy and encourage "honest" dialog on a number of topics that affect us as nudists and we're not just going to talk "nicey nice" about being naked all the time. This is a touchy subject because most of us struggle with weight issues. I'm overweight and I know there are things I can do, besides exercise, to curb my weight gain, lose weight and/or maintain my weight. "Technically" ... I am considered obsese ... although my doctor has said ... my appearance doesn't lend itself to what others consider obese. For my height ... I'm overweight by enough to be considered obese but since my weight is distributed pretty evenly throughout my body ... I don't appear obese, in the sense that some have in their minds as to what "obese" is and looks like. We need to be able to speak our minds, give our opinions and it taken as an opinion and not an attack on your opinion or that you are thinking what we are saying is "right" and what you're saying is "wrong." I know a couple of members here from other sites and I tell ya ... this site and "this" group has NEVER gotten as ugly, made personal attacks and nowhere near as uncivil as one site, in particular, that Lacey and I are on, elsewhere. This is good, adult, honest conversation ... that other site, Lacey, is junk and I've left it once and I'm getting ready to leave it again. ;) | |
| Sunofabeach, what did you think was going to happen when you posted it? FP, I've been online, in some form or fashion, since 1987. I've seen a lot of sites (back when I started, they were bbs's) come and go. I've been on and off countless ones. When I first got into the AN group, it seemed welcoming and accepting. I have only been on NCH a couple of months, and this is the second thread posted along this vein. There was a post by SB, directed at me, that turned me off to this group. If you'll notice, I haven't posted here for awhile, but I have been posting in other groups. I just don't feel at home here anymore. | |
| Frankly, I found this topic both shocking and disturbing. I spent a lot of time as a Navy SEAL so I certainly understand the "take care of yourself and live healthy" thing but what I don't understand is the "I don't like seeing or even being around..." attitude. I mean, really! It reminds me of a woman in the PTA of my daughter's grade school who didn't think that the normal students should have to see or be around the Special Ed kids, like Downs Syndrome, because they were different, somehow disgusting or "not as good". Some of the nicest folks that I have met at nude venues have been a bit (or a lot) on the heavy side but have been fun to be around and beautiful people in terms of personality and warmth. I wouldn't trade one of them for any dozen glamor queens without enough brains to parse a sentence in simple English. If any of you ladies present feel insulted by some of the posts in this topic let me assure you that you are all free to join my wife and myself poolside at any time, nude or clothed makes no difference. And let me assure you that you will be treated with the respect that all of us are due. | |
| Here's a good question.... who's to say who is health and who is fat? Isnt it a personal choice? What one person conciders fat or unhealthy may not be to someone else. Sounds like there might be some judging going on here from some so called non judging people. | |
| I dunno...for example, I'm uncircumsized - one of the rare and the few. If someone was to say "uncircumcized penises are disgusting/unhealthy"; yeah, perhaps that would sting a bit. For about 3 seconds. Because ultimately, it is just an opinion; expressed by someone's who's probably never even seen me nude. It's not going to affect my self-opinion or self-esteem or prevent me from being nude, or have me running to the doctor to get circumcized. I've been offered free advice about the health risks about having an uncircumsized penis; which I have chosen to ignore. I think I live my life in a healthy enough manner. I know it may seem like a weird analogy...but I think it's something to consider... | |
| With due respect. We don't care about you being uncut. half the world or greater is. We don't care about ur penis or how big or small it is. i'm glad ur satisfied with ur body. thats a very healthy thing. but remember it takes all kinds, skinny, fat, shy, type A personality, short, tall, pretty, ugly, physically fit, disabled, smart, intellectually challenged. so personally i think ur reference to ur penis is ok. if mu wanted to talk about ur elbow, how about your big toe. thats ok too. our bodies are a means to ambulate, but our thoughts and values are what makes who we are. | |
| I always love it when someone says ... "with all due respect" ... or ... "I'm sorry, but..." Your reply to Nudony's post was not respectful. Too bad you couldn't see the correlation in his analogy but decided to interject your own color descriptions of his penis that he DID NOT go into. Go into ANY topics about circumcision and you'll find all the disrespectful and uncivil remarks made by those that are cut against those that are not. Health, cleanliness, aesthetics ... "I'm sorry but ... my cut penis looks better...," "with all due respect... my cut penis is cleaner than your uncut penis..." It's ALL the same arguments and discussions ... doesn't matter if it's cut/uncut penis, real or fake boobs, tats, piercings, skinny, fat, pretty or ugly ... we all have opinions and they are just like A holes ... everyone's got one. So ... why is it so hard to just voice your opinion and stop taking everything so dang personal. Your opinion MAY just open someone's eyes to a view they'd not thought of before ... or are we ALL too educated to learn something new!? ;) | |
| Anyone who says weight doesn't matter in reference to health is lying to themselves. This is not a personal attack on anyone either, but it is something that many people refuse to acknowledge. I'm not talking specifically about anyone here, I'm speaking of the entire world population. There is definitely a point at which excessive weight indeed becomes a health issue. The guy who weighs 800 lbs. and can't get out of bed, can we all agree that that person is not healthy? The extreme opposite is also true, when we see the anorexic that looks like only skin and bones, this too is not healthy. This is not a matter of opinion or personal preference of what "looks good" or "looks gross", it is most definitely a scientific biological fact that weight does influence health. The problem in my opinion (notice, just my opinion, not necessarily fact) is that when one is overweight or even obese, they may feel that they have let themselves down, that they just don't have the will-power or self-discipline to keep their weight under control. Now, this part is fact... though one might feel this way, in most cases today it is NOT a matter of lack of will-power or self-disipline, but rather a result of essentially being poisoned by what used to be quality food. GMO (Genetically Modified Organisms) are slowly killing us! They are in all kinds of foods and aren't labeled. Recent lab tests have shown that a steady diet of GMO ingredients causes tumors and excessive weight gain. Artificial sweeteners and artificial flavorings cause a LOT of weight gain, and these too are often disquised with seemingly harmless sounding names in the ingredients list. If you think you are eating healthy, you might actually still not be due to food companies essentially lying to you about what is in their products. You are also lied to by the government's published "food pyramid" guide to health. That thing is garbage and if followed is guaranteed to cause weight gain. | |
| FireProf, I agree that i was untactful in my last post. I apologize if i misunderstood the analogy. I'm a newbe here and a bit overzealous. I had a daughter that was picked on in school refering to the size of her bum and thighs. Yes, obesity is a health problem, but lets show some compassion for those who by either physical or psychological reasons can't shed the pounds. I think I might be too biased on this subject so I leave it to you and the other members to hash it out. I'll not participate on this subject again. | |
| I wasn't going to comment on this one but finally had to. I believe that the reason for the post was not health, lifestyle, food quality, etc., but the following two statements from the first post. "But I do not like seeing or even being around someone who is obese and nude." "Ive tried to introduce others to the world of social nudism and the one big turnoff for them is being around folks who are 100 pounds overweight. They just dont like seeing it or being around it." He just doesn't like looking at obese/fat people. That is the same as saying he doesn't like seeing women or certain minorities or the hanicapped. It isn't about health issues or unhealthy lifestyles but I just don't like seeing them As for the second statement the people saying that are using an excuse you side with to hide the fact they just don't want to try it. Did they say this because they knew it was his attitude and he wouldn't push it. I probably should have taken Mark Twains advice and not missed an opportunity to shut up. | |
| [Cancer Survivor Quote: FireProf, I agree that i was untactful in my last post. I apologize if i misunderstood the analogy. I'm a newbe here and a bit overzealous. I had a daughter that was picked on in school refering to the size of her bum and thighs. Yes, obesity is a health problem, but lets show some compassion for those who by either physical or psychological reasons can't shed the pounds. I think I might be too biased on this subject so I leave it to you and the other members to hash it out. I'll not participate on this subject again. End Quote] CS ... it's entirely up to you if you want to leave this discussion. But I think you and some others are missing the point of this discussion and many like it on the Absolute Naturist Group. There was another thread started by SunBunny a while back and in her opening statement and question she reiterated that the discussion was NOT about those with physical and physiological ailments but those that simply feel that since "nudism/naturism" is a "body accepting" lifestyle ... it was felt that many people just let themselves go and then decide to become nudists or ... nudists decide ... I don't care what I look like anymore and since everyone will accept me ... I don't have to care anymore. Does anyone see the difference? I need to lose 30 lbs. I have three bulging disks in my lower back, two in my neck, two bad knees (one needing surgery soon), two torn rotator cuffs (one needing surgery soon) ... to exercise is painful. How do I maintain or lose weight? and I love to eat and drink. Watch what I eat, how much I eat and the toughest part ... cut out the alcohol! Not what I want to do but I have to try and maintain a certain weight so I don't feel worse and when I'm able to exercise ... I still only have to lose 30 lbs instead of 60 or more! It's always been about "health" this topic but some feel that it's a direct attack on them personally. The OP didn't state in his opening post that he discounted those with physical and physiological ailments but many of us that posted took those into account first and foremost. For those that took offense; it might have worked better to just state your particular issues and give some of us more of an understanding of what problems some obese people face instead of going on the defensive and counter attacking people that didn't intend for anyone to take this discussion ... personally. ;) | |
| If someone is fat, they are fat. Who cares? There are overweight people out there. It's not my place to tell others how to live their lives, and nobody has to live up to my expectations. | |
| ok in the origonal stament about this topic it was said that ppl dont like 2 b around or near big ppl ... ( I know its not good though and when I see an obese person I naturally think that they have no regard for their personal well being. But I do not like seeing or even being around someone who is obese and nude.) so if u dont take time out 2 get to know a person how do you know they have let themselvs go or they have a medical problem ..... u r just judging ppl ( sorry 4 spelling mistakes lol ) and naturism is about acceptance of all and a good clean way of a lifetyle and not to judge others .. like any life style u get all diff ppl from all walks of life .. and all shapes and size ... | |
| I'm glad this thread was started because to me it is a fundamental issue of Nudism. The way I see it every nudist should be accepted as family no matter what physical form or condition they are in, whether they be over weight, have scars, lost limbs in the war, or even those in great shape who are also discriminated against in certain groups. No one is perfect and the whole point is that we nudists are free to be ourselves with each other without reservation. Maybe everyone doesn't feel that way, but they should. I thought that was the whole point of nudism. You could come over strip off your clothes, relax and be yourself in a way that you cannot anywhere else no matter who you are because we nudists appreciate being human in a way that others just don't get. Circumstances get the better of people, myself included, but in my view nudists of all kinds are welcome as family. I'm sad that there are people who would drop this group due to the negative reactions because it is important for every nudist to be socially active and I appreciate everyone here who takes the time to post their thoughts and make themselves known. | |
| This is true and like getting different people from all walks and shapes of life ... you get many with strong feelings and opinions about some things. Since the OP stated his negative reactions to those that are obese ... I don't see anyone that is obese to become friends with him ... but, that doesn't mean that everyone feels the same way. That's the intent of these topics ... is to see and hear different opinions on a variety of topics and issues and then decide if knowing someone better is right for you. ;) | |
| lol i would gladley make friends with him .. but some ppl never come into the vid chat 4 others 2 get 2 know them or them 2 get 2 know us ... i like 2 chat 2 a person and get 2 know them b4 i add 2 my friends list ... i have noticed alot post messages and comments about there oppinions and that is good 2 read peoples oppinions but alot seem 2 judge b4 making friends and giving there oppinions b4 they have actualy sat down and had a convo with some1 ... but may be he wouldnt like 2 chat 2 me after all im obese lol tc all x | |
| Rollercoaster, I hear what you're saying and agree but ... a person's physical appearance isn't automatically grounds for becoming friends ... skinny or fat. I've met a ton of people on the internet and from the conversations I've had with them or the banter between us ... I don't think I care to meet them ... no matter what their physical stature. I think it's imperative that we communicate and share opinions because it can change some people's minds about certain issues and subjects but for the most part ... many of us have already made up our minds about certain people and it's not always about physical appearances. For me ... it's about much more than that. ;) | |
| "I've met a ton of people on the internet and from the conversations I've had with them or the banter between us ... I don't think I care to meet them ... no matter what their physical stature." Personally - and that's just my opinion - internet banter, debates or disagreements doesn't really affect my disposition towards meeting or not meeting anyone in person. The internet is anonymous, which allows people to "cut loose" in terms of their opinions or proclivities. An opinion or proclivity which may or may not have any apparent manifestation in the nudist world. The guy who defends erections online is probably not going to walk up to you with a full-on boner. The older guy who rants about his dislike of noisy kids is probably not going to start screaming at them at the resort. They're just going to go online and rant about it. And (not directed at you FP, but as a general statement) unless you're a sage or a saint, you've probably got something to rant about like everyone else. Another general statement: you're not going to find any real "truth" online; be it about someone's character or what "real" nudism is. Online "personas" are a projection; only a fraction of the human being sitting behind the keyboard. Let's not confuse the "projection" with the reality. I have met a few people from the online world - in the real nudist world. Most of them I've enjoyed meeting; and I can tell you it had nothing to do with their online "personas"; or whether we agreed or disagreed on erections, clothing at resorts...or obesity. | |
| ...and as I stated earlier ... everyone's got their own opinions, from different points of view and for their own reasons. I, personally, don't mind telling the truth and don't see any reason to lie, say things I wouldn't say to anyone's face, embellish on stories, say things I think or know people want to hear. If people think that about me ... that's their priviledge to do so but their rights end where they begin spreading lies or misinformation about me and my thoughts or opinions. There are lots of people I've met, online, that I don't care to meet in public. It's easy to find out. I've erased them from my "friends" list, I don't care to communicate with them ... or ... I will challenge them on what they say about me, friends, places I've visited and misinformation on nudists or naturism. When you take away opinions and argue simple facts and they continue to be boneheads about simple things and argue that the facts are a bunch of bunk ... then I've got no reason to continue a dialog with them. I'm here to learn from other points of view but just cuz you've got a different point of view ... doesn't make it right. I don't have a beef with obese people, I just give my opinion but I've found something very funny about the accepting nudists ... some will NOT allow you to have an opinion. Their opinion is right and whatever you say or state is not entirely correct, out and out wrong, tied to some political affiliation or religion and their opinion's are the only thing that matter and those that think like they do. If you've got a thought or opinion on a subject and it's out of line with several others ... ever see people pounce on the person with the opposing view? Why is it wrong to have an opposing view? I've questioned a great many of these opposing views ... but I at least try and see their side ... more than I can say for many of these people saying what they want to say because they can hide behind a computer screen and be who they want and say what they want. I don't do that and ... I have no desire to meet these people! ;) | |
| Aha. I think we may be talking about different things. I was talking about expressing opinions, and how that opinion is just a fragment of a person. I think you were talking about the willful and deliberate attempt to berate, humiliate and dominate; which can be found mostly on another forum that will remain anonymous. Yeap, "trolling for a fight" sort of stand of its own as an expression of narcissism, intolerance and sometimes even hate. | |
| Ok ... I get what you're saying. But we're about to get a arse chewing for venturing off topic and I'm suppose to keep us on topic! :) ...AND ... just to be clear; you and I have known each other for a long time. We don't always agree ... and I think that's healthy, but I'd still like to meet YOU and talk in person. We seem to be on the same page some of the time, most of the time but not all the time. :D | |
| I've wondered if the increase in obesity is epigenetic. "Epigenetic" means that there are genes that "turn on" other genes. The way that it works out where we can see it is that your parents can do something that may not affect them, but that they pass along to you. I was into health food for a while, and read a pamphlet about kittens inheriting gingivitis from parents that were fed junk. I dismissed that as credulous nonsense, but since the Human Genome Project, and other recent research into genetics, we've picked up a mechanism for the kittens' unhealthy gums. And maybe for people who put on weight because of their parents' diets. | |
| I'm probably missing the meaning here, but I thought the purpose of the nudist lifestyle was for health purposes, thus most nudists are concerned about the shape of their body. Body acceptance meant you have the type of body that is acceptable to the general community. I think most nudists nowadays have turned the phrase "body acceptance" to mean "I'm overweight and out of shape- Accept It!" Oh well. At least I have the the resort's entire gym to myself. | |
| Detach, body acceptance is about accepting your own body not trying to be accepted by others. Most of the time other people's reactions to our naked bodies are a reflection of their own inadequacies and not real acceptance. Trying to gain other people's approval to validate your self-esteem is a no win situation. In nudism I'm only concerned about my body and health. Other people's body condition is not my business or mine to judge. Health and fitness are important for everyone, but some are more successful at it than others and some people have a different perspective on what that really means. Nudism for me is a relief from the pretentiousness of the textile world. | |
| I agree that body acceptance is about accepting your own body, and the nudist lifestyle is helping me towards that goal. But you must admit that the nudist lifestyle has its hypocrisies. First, the lifestyle does consist primarily of out of shape individuals, though I suppose the same holds true with the U.S. society in general. Also, you aren't free from the textile world as people still wear clothing and adornments to stand out from the rest of the nudist community. Many people go around dressed at the resorts and still wear way too much jewelry when nude to establish themselves as superior to the rest of the community. And finally, nudists nowadays are a very sexual society. I'm sure you've experienced the advances of women, who proposition you, grab you or kiss you even if you are in a steady relationship. But you are right, the condition of other people's bodies isn't our business to judge. Thus, it's not acceptance of the various body types, but rather tolerance that we exercise at the nudist venues. | |
| First let me say that I am 65-yrs. young and before I lost 20 lbs. in 2 months not trying and the docs don't know why, I am finally back to 118 and need to GAIN 7 more lbs. to get back to where I need to be. Owning a home with 7 acres (happily 4 of them are woods) is a great exercise program. I totally understand constant pain. I've got a back (cervical through sacrum) that on x-ray looks like a sandcastle that has had water thrown at it. A few medical professionals have said no one can help. I'm allergic to codeine and morphine. We've tried Fentanyl that made me feel like a zombie. I know what pain is. I still push myself to rake, weed-eat, haul brush, etc. Just don't let my doctors know. ;) There are a few new studies called Distraction therapy. Nudism is about accepting yourself and OTHERS for who they are, how we act, and what we say rather than what we look like, own, or wear. I personally don't care what someone looks like; it definitely is what's inside that counts. You know the old adage "don't judge a book by its cover" really is what we're about. I've had friends who were over 300 lbs. I've had friends who were emaciated. I don't care. I do care if they're healthy and happy. | |
| Nudism started with the goals of fitness and self improvement. Now nudism is about acceptance and tolerance. Nothing wrong with that. But maybe nudism has been redefined too much and we need to get back to the original goals. | |
| Armadillo, everyone has different reasons for getting into nudism. I see nudism as not letting your condition 'right now' prevent you from enjoying life and clothes-freedom. I think health and fitness are important for everyone, but has nothing to do with being without clothing. I think there are obese nudists because there are obese people and from what I have seen it is a typical cross section of society. Fit people are resented as much in the textile world as in the nudist world these days. For human nature, clothed-unclothed, is the same. Best thing to do is not to get preachy or judgmental, but to encourage an active lifestyle and healthy eating. Some people will take to it and some people won't. The local fitness guy in my office encourages everyone to go mountain biking with him and do fun runs. He gets a few takers, but is leading by example. He always tells the story of how he was overweight and out of shape for many years and finally had a revelation one day to be more active and eat better. He didn't worry about weight. Someday, I hope to be that guy, but it's not the case at this very moment. All you can do is encourage healthy habits. We should be less concerned with the number on a scale. |
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